BIG news from Makie labs.

from jen: Folks! This week's orders (placed up until the print run on Monday 14th) will ship with 3DP bodies.
Potential IM rollout has now shifted to next week's orders, and I'd advise you to believe that orders placed from next Monday morning (0900 GMT) onwards are going to receive IM bodies. That's the safest course of action to avoid disappointment, unless of course you definitely *want* the new body, in which case hold fire and I'll update as soon as we reach clarity on it next week.
I'm aware that photos of the new bodies would be helpful for you, and as soon as the bodies are go we'll have them to share.
Aiming for Friday to say farewell to Ice Frosting, so again to be safe please get those orders in within the next couple of days. Thanks

Here's a copy of the reply I received to my question about the compatibility of the old 3DP heads with the new IM bodies, and below that is
A copy of the inquiry I sent.


http://support.mymakie.com/hc/requests/7087

Jen
Jen (Makies Support)
Sep 9, 17:12

Yes, your Makie heads will fit on IM bodies; however, we believe that the current neck joint (which we've redesigned recently to be suitable for IM bodies) will wear faster with that combination, causing the head to get floppier over time, so I wouldn't say it's entirely unproblematic.

It's too soon to tell whether we'll be selling Makies bodies, IM or 3DP, separately in the store between now and the end of the year. 3DP bodies have always been printed on demand, and they're expensive to produce; at the current material/production cost, if we are able to offer bodies separately they're likely to sell for more than a whole Makie doll with an IM body. That doesn't mean we won't do it, but right now we're weighing the opportunity cost of spending our super-limited time and money on that vs. all the other things we'd like to do for Makies over the next few months. I hope this makes sense!

Best wishes,

Jen
Team MakieLab



jryu
Sep 8, 19:02

Hello,
This doesn't have anything to do with my orders, but I do have a question. Will the heads of our already existing 3DP Makies fit on the new IM bodies, and vice versa? Say for example, (heaven forbid!), that the body of one of my old 3DP Makies gets damaged, will the head fit on a new IM body? For that matter, will I even be able to order the new IM body without ordering a head?
I'm just thinking ahead, and when I read that the old hand pack hands aren't going to fit on the new IM bodies, and that the current snap-on shoes are being re-done so that they will work with both body types, then I started wondering about the heads. I mean, it's possible that I could fall in love with this new IM body, and want to upgrade all my existing 3DP Makies to IM bodies.
As you probably know, a doll's soul/character exists in the head of the doll. I realize that I could just completely reprint any of my already 3DP printed dolls, but then they just wouldn't be same doll. A completely new printed IM Ryuu say, just would not be Ryuu! If you understand what I'm trying to say.
I know you are really busy, and it is most likely too late now to create a stockpile of 3DP replacement bodies, but I hope you can find a minute to address my concerns.
Thank you,
JRyu
(One of your loyal, adult doll collector, supporters)

This email is a service from Makies Support. Makielab is a trading name of Makieworld Limited which is registered company number 7557499, England & Wales. Our registered company address is Shoreham Road, Upper Beeding, Steyning, West Sussex BN44 3TN.
Message-Id:6XF6FA1H_55f05a53fc9c_2d033fc7bbacd31c8142a5_sprut

About the change from classics to cuties. Actually, the body switch was earlier than the face switch. So my male classic has the V2 body, while my female has the old body.

I wasn't around for the above, but I do remember when they discontinued the classics. It was posted on the old forum and many people did mass ordering like we see today. The glaring difference is that classics and cuties overlapped. Also, when I first got into Makies, I couldn't make classics, but many people who had made them could still order them.

I ordered my first Makie after the V2 body became standard. I did a bit of reading up on Makies right before V2 came out, and I seem to remember the change being talked about as a good thing overall. However, there definitely were announcements for the cutie faces (I recall seeing a pic posted on the Official Makies fb page featuring Souix's Mushroom and a cute little blonde elf with the then-new Cutie style face). As jupiter mentioned above, quite a few members from the old forum put in orders for the classic faces. I really can't remember if that overlap was about the same length as this current overlap. I also remember when they discontinued the pistachio skin tone; not sure if there was an ordering frenzy due to that though. I still wish I would have gotten at least one. Oh well!

I recall there was a lot of warning about the pistachio colour going away, I think they even annouced it on social media telling people it was the last chance to order didn't they? They had a set date and after that time that was gonna be it.
Same with the classic heads, there was a specific date and warning was clearly given, though not sure if that info was brought across to platforms other than the forum.

Sad the new parts don't sound like they'll be at all compatible. Though if they will still agree to print 3dp bodies on demand in white only, I can get behind that (at the higher price obviously) but it'd be a nice option to remain as a "special request" for those of us who want a white one or to dye. I mean, with the heads there's no reason NOT to allow us to have white heads right? It cuts out a stage in production. the only reason they're discontinuing it is because of the IM bodies. So.... if you could request them not to dye the head and print a body on demand... and of course would pay for the inconvenience. Just not sure what the expense there would be as the body printing presumably happens at a different time to the heads right? it'd be pretty expensive to only print ONE body at a time rather than batches. That's the only real reason I can see for it not being viable, the cost because of printing one body at a time on demand would be a lot higher than the old price,the costs could be kept lower by batch printing meaning less time to rent on the printer. Material cost is one thing, but time to print/space in printer etc is gonna be the biggest issue I can see. 

Anyhoo...

I'm curious to see the new bodies and write up a review of them, i'm also super eager to see my new ones arrive. Tor has been back from the printer since Monday, but he doesn't seem too eager to come home. Bah. And I missed the print run with the other two, they won't go to print till next week.

Also, as the proud owner of a V1 body, I would say that the V2 is better than the V1. The V1 joints are wobbly (at least Allie's are) and look less realistic. They did allow for some rotational movement at the knee, but it was at the expense of sturdy standing/posing and it was pretty subtle. The V1 body also had a very subtle navel and nipples, but I don't think those features add much personally. Oh yeah, and classics also had a hole through the neck up into the head, which hasn't been a problem for Allie or Garrak, but in theory could decrease the durability of the neck joint.

Actually I made a post here comparing Allie (classic V1 body) to Steffie (cutie V2 body) if anyone's interested.

Yeah I definitely always prefered the V2 body, even without having experience of V1. I think the only thing I wish with V2 is that the elbows and knees were rotational. I know it compromises a bit on the sturdy-ness, but I think you could potentially repeat the shoulder and hip ball joints in the elbows and knees, and still have it pose really nice. After all, the shoulders and the hips manage fine. The only reason I can think of for not repeating those joints is to just make sure the casual customer always knows which side to clip the arms and legs onto. Annnndd... a torso/waist joint would be awesome too.

Lamenting articulation is neither here nor there for this thread I suppose. XD Arguably, if I want my makies to have more articulated bodies, then from what I imagine with this IM news, I'd probably need to go mod it/build it myself (not going to happen any time soon, it's not my highest priority).

I reemember pistachio! I never had a makie that colour that I saved, but I remember making a few casually, and I remember people wanting to order theirs before it was discontinued. I can't remember if I've ever seen a photograph of a pistachio makie made real though.

It's kind of a shame all these things aren't offered as options to people willing to spend a bit more. Maybe not the V1 body since I think V2 is much better in every regard that's important (durability, poseability, etc), but classic faces and custom dye orders. I know it's a lot of effort and money to set that up (or at least to set up custom dyeing. I can't imagine there's any cost difference between printing a classic head and a cutie head?) so it's understandable it's not in place, but still. I customise almost everything about my makies myself, but for things I can't do - like make clothes - I'm more than happy to commission someone to do it for me. If they offered more customisation in makies (a wider array of features for heads and bodies), I think my bank account would literally empty itself.

I'm sort of going off topic here haha. I think mostly I just hope that whilst the new IM bodies seem to be largely limiting customisation in the short-term (parts incompatibilities, less colours, etc), that it'll some how make way for more customisation long-term. Makies brand is "the most creative doll in the world", but it's starting to lose some of that I feel. Especially with other services that have popped up (there's an amazing one that I've forgotten the name of but is a service where you customise a 3D figure in your browser, and the customisation options are amazing and extensive, like tweaking shoulder to hip ratio, or the amount the belly protrudes. Once you're done, you can buy a printed version of it. It's a figure rather than a doll, but it... almost offers more than makies at this point?).

I just hope that the customisation will expand again (and by a lot more) in future, rather than continue to decrease!

Maybe they could offer the 3DP bodies as a special once a year thing, make an anouncement, and then open up an order period for 3DP printed bodies and/or dolls.

I would gladly pay a higher price for a 3DP body, especially if I needed it to replace the body of one of my existing 3DP Makies. I'd be fine with only having white bodies available too, and having to do the coloring myself.

If they no longer want to bother with 3DP bodies at all, then make a 3DP body program/pattern available that we can purchase and download, then either print bodies out on our own 3D printer, or take to a 3D printing shop and get bodies printed.

I would be willing to pay double, probably even triple, the old price of a 3DP Makie for a 3DP body program/pattern download, just for the security and peace of mind in knowing that I'd then be able to print out a replacement body for any of my 3DP Makies that needed one.

Lol, I'd pay triple for a more genderless androgynous 3DP body program/pattern download! ^_^

They could do the same thing with the different 3DP hands too, and even occaisionally offer 3DP program/patterns for new hand gestures, tentacles, paws, etc. that will fit our old 3DP Makies.

Granted, we adult doll collectors are a small consumer base, but we tend to be willing to pay hefty sums of money for dolls that are truly unique, and we tend to be very loyal repeat customers who buy multiple dolls. Not to mention also buying clothing and accessories and such for our multiple dolls.

Even Mattel recognizes the value of the adult doll collector market and caters to them, just have a look in their special Barbie Collector catalog sometime.

interestingly when they first started out, they DID allow a great deal of customisation and special orders. You could have tentacle arms if you wanted, or order specific hands from their collection individually. My Vicky for instance has ONE pointing hand, just one. She also is wearing a completely customised wig (which was on John, not sure who made it) and came with a totally custom outfit. I'm sure the whole lot cost a pretty penny to the original owner, the pair were fully customised by sioux and members of the lab crew from what I understand of it. Both had custom outfits, she had a bag and folder too.
Back then I suppose they had the time to take such requests, but woah can you imagine the work and effort that went into that? These days they're a lot busier heh.

Mmm adult collector stuff... heheh. I always like to have options. I'd love more accessories, sooo many more accessories so I didn't have to hunt for non pink spangly 1:6 scale bits and bobs.

I''m very curious to see how they are going to match the new 3DP heads with the IM bodies, color wise.

They've said repeatedly how much variance there is in the dyeing process even from piece to piece, as well as from lot to lot.

Whereas, the IM body colors will be much more uniform and consistent even from lot to lot.

I wonder, are they going to start printing the heads in whatever skin tone type colors the 3D printing plastic is available in, and then use whatever injectable plastic is the closest match?

That would pretty much eliminate the need for the dyeing process altogether.

Plus, since the heads would be solidly pink or brown all the way through, they would be able to polish them smooth to match the smooth IM bodies.

Well, smooth except for the seam lines that all IM products have, or anything produced in a mold for that matter.

Of course, they could remove the seam lines, but then that is going to add time and cost to production.... better just to leave the seam lines.

Also, the pink or brown colored 3D plastic might not be all that great a match to actual skin colors..... Bright Barbie pink Makies anyone?

However, going that route would certainly save some time, and help streamline the production line.


Alternatively, they could just pick three basic skin tones in the injectable plastic, a pink, a tan, and a brown, and continue to dye the heads strawberry, caramel, and mocha.

Which means some heads might turn out to be a pretty close color match to body, while other heads might be darker, lighter, or a totally different shade altogether!

What will they do, just pop the Mocha heads on the brown bodies, and the strawberry heads on the pink bodies, etc. whether they really actually match or not?

Like I said, I really am curious to see how they handle this......

Yeah I've been wondering how they new bodies will match up to the variation in 3DP dye results.

nattherat wrote:I reemember pistachio! I never had a makie that colour that I saved, but I remember making a few casually, and I remember people wanting to order theirs before it was discontinued. I can't remember if I've ever seen a photograph of a pistachio makie made real though.

For anybody's curiosity, I found a video with a pistachio makie (although the lighting makes it a bit hard to see at times).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vnT9lMR3ATg

Arghh..... Every time I turn around, I come up with another question/concern regarding this change to IM bodies!

If the old 3DP heads will become loose and floppy after time, when placed on the new IM bodies, then obviously one type of plastic is stronger and/or more abrasive than the other since it will apparently wear the joint down over time to where the head or limb becomes loose and floppy. So, does this mean that even the new 3DP printed heads will also become loose and floppy over time on the new IM bodies?

How about the new 3DP printed shoes that will supposedly be compatible with the new IM bodies as well as the old 3DP ones, will they also eventually become loose and floppy too? I'm thinking that would seriously impact the dolls ability to pose and stand unassisted.

Which plastic is the harder, more abrasive one? I'm guessing it's the 3DP plastic, which means the plastic that is getting worn down will be the IM plastic. So does that mean that our future Makie's IM bodies will eventually need to be replaced with new IM bodies?
......but, didn't Jen just say that they weren't even sure if they would be offering IM replacement bodies for sale? o_0

So what happens when the IM body's neck joint, or the Foot/shoe joints get worn down, is the expectation that people will just chuck the whole doll, and simply re-order it head and all? :-/

Even if they do decide to offer IM replacement bodies/parts for sale, what happens with our old IM bodies/parts? Will they be recyclable, or just more landfill?

True, some bits might be still be useful as spare parts, but there will still be other parts that aren't, they won't really even be useful for dye/paint testing, since you can't really dye IM plastic.

Just now, looking at the little Makies brochure that comes with your order, it says they are "kind to the earth"..... that "Makie production has as little environmental impact as possible.",.......

With mass produced injection molded plastic bodies now, can they really even still make that claim?

*************************************************************************************************************************

See what I mean, Questions!

Here I'm supposed to be focusing on getting ready for us to leave for this big Anime convention, and instead my mind keeps going back over and over to all of this! Like some little obsessive compulsive hamster in its wheel!

Arghh.......

Purple_Monkfish wrote:from jen: Folks! This week's orders (placed up until the print run on Monday 14th) will ship with 3DP bodies.
Potential IM rollout has now shifted to next week's orders, and I'd advise you to believe that orders placed from next Monday morning (0900 GMT) onwards are going to receive IM bodies. That's the safest course of action to avoid disappointment, unless of course you definitely *want* the new body, in which case hold fire and I'll update as soon as we reach clarity on it next week.
I'm aware that photos of the new bodies would be helpful for you, and as soon as the bodies are go we'll have them to share.
Aiming for Friday to say farewell to Ice Frosting, so again to be safe please get those orders in within the next couple of days. Thanks

Quick question...do you guys believe this statement means that we can still order 3d bodies Saturday and Sunday, or does it mean that because the order will not be seen until Monday that these bodies would get the newer bodies?
At first I read it one way, but now I don't know which way to interpret this statement.

Since they disabled our ability to order the white ones today I would assume that any dolls ordered this weekend will have the IM bodies.

ForestGreen wrote:Since they disabled our ability to order the white ones today I would assume that any dolls ordered this weekend will have the IM bodies.

Okay thanks.

I was thinking about how it was such a big deal to hear about the #ToyLikeMe doll Melissa with her facial birthmark. I'm guessing now they won't be making her or doing any other customization on birthmarks anymore since there's no more dyeing. That's unfortunate

Well you can still paint the faces and IM bodies CAN be painted on, it's just not as natural looking as the 3dp body because you can't do as much blushing and careful building up of the pigment. they can still do facial birthmarks though.

In the very first post of this thread, In the quoted message from Jen, she says, "Slip-on shoes will be backwardly compatible."

Could someone please explain just what she means by backwardly compatible?

Lol, my silly brain is stuck on the mental image of a Makie having to wear his shoes on backwards and just refuses to move past that, even though I know full well that's not what Jen means. 9_9 ;D

It means compatible with all the old 3DP feet!  Another way of putting it would be retroactively compatible, I think, if that makes it a bit easier to digest.
But yes, it means that those particular shoes should work with old and new bodies.

JRyu wrote:In the very first post of this thread, In the quoted message from Jen, she says, "Slip-on shoes will be backwardly compatible."

Could someone please explain just what she means by backwardly compatible?  

Lol, my silly brain is stuck on the mental image of a Makie having to wear his shoes on backwards and just refuses to move past that, even though I know full well that's not what Jen means. 9_9   ;D

You know, I honestly thought when I first read her statement that meant weird oval feet for future makies and weird oval shoes to go along with them (something non-foot shaped)...grant it I read the original post while not having slept for about 30 hours.  Haha
But yeah as nattherat said, it would mean compatible with all the old 3DP feet

Thanks nattherat and sigsi. That helped, lol, that mental picture was beginning to drive me nuts. ^_~

yes, that's what I suspected it meant, and I kept trying to tell my brain that, but it has a tendency, when encountering an unfamiliar way of phrasing something, of applying the most literal interpretation it can come up with and sticking to it. Retroactively, is the term I'm more used to, and I was trying to think of that word when I was trying to convince my brain that Jen did not mean that the new Makies would have to wear the shoes backwards.

Lol, and of course it doesn't help that I'm one of those extremely visually oriented people, who thinks entirely in pictures

The first picture of the new bodies?
From here: https://instagram.com/p/7qPLZOqOrJ/

Looks like it, there is a shine on the cocoa girl leg...

That cocoa girl and boy next to her are really bugging my ocd over here.  The heads are different colors than the bodies